ronny

Natural Treatment That Works (For Me)

64 posts in this topic

As opposed to just kutaj, and playing with amounts in the raw herb, which will likely vary, which probably accounts for the "tolerance" and "fluctuation" you notice, Ronny.

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As opposed to just kutaj, and playing with amounts in the raw herb, which will likely vary, which probably accounts for the "tolerance" and "fluctuation" you notice, Ronny.

 

The tolerance happens with Betahistidine as well, so I do not believe varying dosage of the active ingredient in Kutaj is an issue. My theory is that as the body increases Histamine production it needs more of the amino acid L-Histidine (the precursor for Histamine). I have been eating a mostly vegan diet giving the body less L-Histidine than normal.

 

I'm currently taking Kutaj or Betahistine together with a L-Hisdine supplement. This so far seems to work well. I have tried it for just a couple of days though so its to early to say for sure, but the effect is now equally strong as it used to be in the beginning, so I suspect the combination of Kutaj and L-Hisdine is the solution.

 

I have tried L-Hisdine by itself previously, but with no effect at all.

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The tolerance happens with Betahistidine as well, so I do not believe varying dosage of the active ingredient in Kutaj is an issue. My theory is that as the body increases Histamine production it needs more of the amino acid L-Histidine (the precursor for Histamine). I have been eating a mostly vegan diet giving the body less L-Histidine than normal.

 

I'm currently taking Kutaj or Betahistine together with a L-Hisdine supplement. This so far seems to work well. I have tried it for just a couple of days though so its to early to say for sure, but the effect is now equally strong as it used to be in the beginning, so I suspect the combination of Kutaj and L-Hisdine is the solution.

 

I have tried L-Hisdine by itself previously, but with no effect at all.

Yeah, it makes sense, l-histidine itself wouldn't promote wakefulness if the H3R's are being activated..that's the one histamine receptor that sedates as opposed to stimulate...although, interestingly, it also causes anxiety by inhibiting GABA ; a receptor that depresses the CNS but causes anxiety?

 

Dirty dirty receptor you are. :angry:

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does the "wakefulness" I keep reading about mean it is a stimulant-like jitteriness or clean? I do not have narcolepsy but may have ADHD like symptoms which is why I may be experimenting with an H3 antagonist product. I'm leaning towards naturals first such as Conessine.

 

Then again , I may have narcolepsy considering I sleep at about 7 a.m. and wake up at 3. I work nights so that may be it as well. I'm a night person, so I sleep during the day. I'm not sure it's narcolepsy.

 

How is everyone falling asleep on this Kutaj? One post here said it may keep you up and disrupt sleep, but isn't this dose dependent? One Kutaj product on amazon suggested to take 3-6 capsules. Wouldn't taking one be a good start? It didn't say what dosage it is per capsule. It is from Vadik Herbs.

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does the "wakefulness" I keep reading about mean it is a stimulant-like jitteriness or clean? I do not have narcolepsy but may have ADHD like symptoms which is why I may be experimenting with an H3 antagonist product. I'm leaning towards naturals first such as Conessine.
 
Then again , I may have narcolepsy considering I sleep at about 7 a.m. and wake up at 3. I work nights so that may be it as well. I'm a night person, so I sleep during the day. I'm not sure it's narcolepsy.
 
How is everyone falling asleep on this Kutaj? One post here said it may keep you up and disrupt sleep, but isn't this dose dependent? One Kutaj product on amazon suggested to take 3-6 capsules. Wouldn't taking one be a good start? It didn't say what dosage it is per capsule. It is from Vadik Herbs.

 

VADIK Herbs and MORPHEME are the two only suppliers of KUTAJ in capsule form, DR.WAKDE sells it by 100G bags but you have to encapsulate them yourself - drinking it is not recommended for 99.9% of people per my assessment in taste. Mind you, I have a titanium stomach, maybe even 3/4th of the way to adamantium, and this stuff still has to be shot down as quick as a shot glass - the smell is enough to make me queazy, and I never get sick, literally.

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Morpheme has their capsules at 500mg each, Vadik Herbs has no mention of it (not on their site or amazon either). Does anyone here know how many mg the Vadik Herbs Kutaj product has per capsule?

 

Update: I just bought the Vadik Herbs product and still waiting for it. So if amphetamines are prescribed for narcolepsy and Connessine works just as well, would that also mean the latter should work for ADHD?

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Not sure what R.R. is

 

But regarding Adderall I think it's because of the levotory amphetamine that's in it. Adderalli is 75% dextroamphetamine and 25% levotory amphetamine. levo is what makes one feel jittery, dextro euphoric and focused. I would think pure dextroamphetamine (Dexedrine) is better, at low dose. Levoamphetamine are sold over the counter at any pharmacy like Walgreens and Walmart as nasal decongestant. I've tried it. There was some euphoria but also a "crash". 

 

If someone here ever had Dexedrine before let me know if there was a "crash". I'm not sure why doctors would prescribe Adderrall over Dexedrine. Are they following some type of endorsement type of deal here?

 

 

I'd say RR and coffee are a lot safer than Adderall, but it depends how each person responds.  I know that they are not safe in me.  The max is one 500mg capsule of RR, and that's at the high end.  If you were taking two, that explains it.

 

One of the things I've learned is that the textbook doses of Xyrem, Adderall require other meds (anxiolytics, beta blockers) to balance the side effects and that the regimen has to be changed every so often, or amphetamine tolerance will develop over time.  If only amphetamines are used, it eventually leads to a downward spiral.  My doctor and I have fought tooth and nail over this point.  He wants me to follow a consistent regimen, and I said I bake this cake by feel, not by a fixed recipe.  No two days are the same.

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I just received my Vadik Herbs Kutaj supplement. It is 450 mg per capsule. The suggested dose is 1-3 caps daily. I will start at 1 daily. Will this keep me up if I take it at night?

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"Orexin, also called hypocretin, is a neurotransmitter that regulates arousal, wakefulness, and appetite.[1] The most common form of narcolepsy, in which the sufferer briefly loses muscle tone (cataplexy), is caused by a lack of orexin in the brain due to destruction of the cells that produce it.[2]

 

High levels of orexin-A have been associated with happiness in human subjects, while low levels have been associated with sadness.[25] The finding suggests that boosting levels of orexin-A could elevate mood in humans, being thus a possible future treatment for disorders like depression. Likewise, it helps explain the incidence of depression associated with narcolepsy." Wiki

 

So would the new drug Suvorexant be good for mood then? I would use the drug for that reason (arousal?) but I do not have narcolepsy or insomnia. I could use a stimulant actually which is why I am going to try out some H3 (Kutaj).

 

"Suvorexant (trade name Belsomra) is a selective dual orexin receptor antagonist marketed by Merck & Co. for the treatment of insomnia.[1] It is effective for insomnia, at least for four weeks and as compared to a placebo.[2]" Wiki

 

So it is for the treatment of insomnia (opposite of narcolepsy?).

 

"It is unclear how this medication compares to others used for insomnia as no comparisons have been done.[2] It is also unclear if this medication is safe among people with a history of addiction as they were not allowed into the trials.[2]" Wiki

 

Not sure why the drug is a schedule IV. Is Orexin the new dopamine considering the talk of addiction and or arousal (maybe another hint for being euphoric). Is the drug then euphoric?

 


"Suvorexant exerts its therapeutic effect in insomnia through antagonism of orexin receptors. The orexin neuropeptide signaling system is a central promoter of wakefulness. Blocking the binding of wake-promoting neuropeptides orexin A and orexin B to receptors orexin receptor type 1 and orexin receptor type 2 is thought to suppress wake drive.[6]Animal studies report the binding affinites for OX1(0.55 nM) and OX2(0.35 nM).[11]" Wiki

 

Not sure I get what their saying here, does Suvorexant promote wakefulness but also puts you to sleep? Can someone break it down for me please.

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Alrighty I got my answer then. Is Kutaj still working for some here? Is there still negative side effects with taking a Conessine source according to Potato? I hope he was just making assumptions because I could not find any info regarding the sides he mentioned on the first page. Maybe the ones who have tried Kutaj can tell me how it is. What dose?

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Curious if Kutaj's actions as anti diarrhea is reliable or must I still get Pepto Bismol? I'd prefer the herbals and since I have some Kutaj, but never tried it yet, just want to know if people found it effective for its purported uses.

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Isn't GHB technically "natural" as well? I'm curious since the indication for the Italian version of Xyrem in Italy (called Alcover) is for alcoholism I would assume it isn't a controlled product in Italy?

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On 4/18/2015 at 3:29 PM, eon said:

Curious if Kutaj's actions as anti diarrhea is reliable or must I still get Pepto Bismol? I'd prefer the herbals and since I have some Kutaj, but never tried it yet, just want to know if people found it effective for its purported uses.

The only side-effects I encountered were anxiety at very very high doses. Don't use too much. 

On 2/18/2015 at 4:47 AM, eon said:

I just received my Vadik Herbs Kutaj supplement. It is 450 mg per capsule. The suggested dose is 1-3 caps daily. I will start at 1 daily. Will this keep me up if I take it at night?

Not at that dosage. It would take at least 7 capsules to keep you awake that long. Do not combine Kutaja with MAO inhibitors under any circumstances.

Purified Conessine from a lab might be easier to dose, but too much of it is cardiotoxic.

Read these.

http://area1255.blogspot.com/2015/12/common-rare-safety-advice-precautions.html

http://area1255.blogspot.com/2015/12/herbs-to-protect-against-prevent.html

 

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