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The Depression Corner


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#1 DeathRabbit

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 06:20 PM

This is a thread for us who are depressed (which is most of us) to talk about it, rather than the other threads where we clinically analyze it. One of the things that sucks about depression is that even when I do have a fun vacation or something, I'm absolutely crushed at the end of it. Me and the girlfriend went to Atlanta this weekend. Or rather she drug me to Atlanta because she is a huge Final Fantasy nerd and the ASO was playing some music from across the whole series. Anyway, it's only the second time I've been to Atlanta as an adult, so it was a really neat adventure. Skipping ahead, after I dropped her off at her house today and started heading back to my place, I began bawling like a pathetic asshole, just because I was sad the weekend was over and I was gonna have to be lonely again until I see her in 2 weeks. I think part of the problem is I also just started Topamax for my headaches, which has been really effing with my head, and I've been under stress at work, as well as stuff in the relationship itself not going so hot lately. Oh, and my 19 yr old brother whom I was almost a pseudo-parent to for the first ten years of his life til I went off to college just got his gf pregnant during his first year of college, so now I'm a premature uncle. But regardless of all those other stressors, I've always had the post vacation/fun acute anxiety/depression attacks. If I ever eat a bullet, it'll be the day after the best day of my life.

 

I guess I'll sum up my feelings with a quote from the smoking man: "Life is like a box of chocolates. A cheap, thoughtless, perfunctory gift that nobody ever asks for. Unreturnable because all you get back is another box of chocolates. So you're stuck with this undefinable whipped mint crap that you mindlessly wolf down when there's nothing else left to eat. Sure, once in a while there's a peanut butter cup or an English toffee. But they're gone too fast and the taste is... fleeting. So, you end up with nothing but broken bits filled with hardened jelly and teeth-shattering nuts. And if you're desperate enough to eat those, all you got left is an empty box filled with useless brown paper wrappers."



#2 iturnedintoamartian

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 09:25 PM

Glad to know depression is somewhat common here. I don't get depressed like I used to- that terrible, sob feeling you get with no explanation as to why. Now I have explanations. My marriage sucks and always has (although we're always working on it). I have $30,000 of student loan debt and no degree. I am very smart but will likely never get a job at my par. I play guitar and teach but haven't been able to write one damned decent song in 3 years. The only thing that makes me happy is my 18 month old. But even then, I only want to be around him, and all the time. I hate that people see that as unhealthy and I hate that I let that influence how I parent at times. I fear the day he learns what the world is. I wish I could protect him forever. I hate going out in public and hate that I hate going out in public. And while we're on the Complaint Express, could I lose some weight already?! Really, though, nothing is wrong with getting sobby. Sometimes I become so numb not even the worst thought can induce a tear. I guess it's a coping mechanism I developed about 12 years ago.

#3 DeathRabbit

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 12:44 AM

There's nothing wrong with constant attention at a really young age. Now if he's an 18 yr old, that's a problem, lol. But at that young, I think proper attention yields children that are more intelligent. I personally think my parents should have backed off when I got into my latter years (maybe 9+), but it was a tremendous academic boost that I could read novels by first grade, due to my mother's constant reading with me, when the latch key kids were still struggling to sound out words. But yea, don't feel bad because it sounds like you are doing right to me.

 

You seem to have a lot of doublethink demonstrated in that post; I'm a victim of that as well. It's a reason my political ideologies end up so weird. I see the merit and flaws in every side. I also end up attacking my own thoughts. As soon as I have an idea, I "un-have" it: that is to say, I pick it apart. I envy certitude almost as much as I despise it. <----- See, right there! I both love and despise a concept! (that was totally unintentional, just caught myself doing it) I'll borrow a line from Goethe's Faust: "Alas, two souls are housed within my breast!"

 

As far as nothing being wrong with sobbing, no offense meant, but you aren't a guy. We have it drilled into our head from day one that it's weak, shameful, and craven. So whenever I'm distraught enough to cry, it just makes the self-hate train start rolling 1000x worse once the first tear falls or the first sob is uttered. Ideas like "what a sorry excuse for a man I am", "how could I ever be a proper husband/provider/protector if I go to pieces so easily", and "what right do I have to be upset when there's people being starved/raped/murdered/killed somewhere in the world while I throw myself a first world pity party" start running through my head. But the numbness is scary too, though I think the meds often are the reason my affect gets so flattened. Anyway, I'm delirious from exhaustion, so I hope this post made some sense!



#4 doinmdarndest

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 06:42 AM

my gf and I have a depressing situation.  I need more rx Adderall and I cannot get it.  when the 300mg/d rx runs out prematurely as I must take 450mg/d to function, we must spend a lot of money for an alternate source of wakefulness im not allowed to mention here.

 

we scarcely get by.  if things collapse I will be homeless again; there will be nothing/no one.  and through a dismal, unmedicated haze of somnolence, save about 2 weeks each month if I still have my rx'er/rx, as this is how long the pills can have me wakeful each month. 3 at the most if I do no work. 

 

after that rip van winkle I become.  and unlike normal folk, this does not correct itself in a few days.  w/o meds it goes on for months.  and I am never fully wakeful w/o meds.  before them I didn't know what wakefulness was.  dropped out in the 7th grade because of this.

 

I hope to find an md who will rx 450mg/d Adderall, which would liberate me from both huge expense and need to interact w criminal element.

 

seeking one out has proven to be an exercise in futility-sheer, abject futility.

 

I must persist as best I can.  the collapse of my program (job, etc.)  appears ever-more imminent/forthcoming.

 

the fact that 450mg/d Adderall is indicated in me seems a thing only my gf and I find real.   the rx will never be written, even as my defacto stimulant intake has been @ about this amt. for years.  it is well tolerated physically.  the alternate source  is breaking our budget.  we must find that md but it is so impossible. 

 

I know for others amphetamines have negative effects but they fit me like a glove.  nobody but my better half understands.  it is bad.  and we are going down for the last time.

 

I am medicated this morning but my supply has run out.  if I can hack the hour and 1/2 drive home unmedicated, after a grueling day digging in a crawl space, I can then pick up my Adderall as it is my fill date.  7am @ jobsite is required of me.  no way out.  I hope I make it back. 

 

grim s.  oh well sira sira, stiff upper lip and all that rot.   good bye for now I gotta get to work



#5 iturnedintoamartian

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 10:13 AM

doinmdarndest- That sounds like an absolutely terrible situation. I am sure you have been asked this before so hopefully it doesn't tick you off, but have you tried any other medications? Maybe there is something in the adderall that makes you have to take so much, that maybe would affect you differently in another medication so you could be prescribed a manageable dose? I can also understand why a doctor would be very reluctant to prescribe that much. Probably the only hope is for you to find a very specialized doctor that can work very closely with you until you find a proper treatment plan. Sometimes what I do if I am afraid I won't be able to get everything on my mind out to a doctor, or afraid I will miss key details, I will write a letter of sorts and force them to read it as soon as I walk in the room, before asking me any questions. It's just an idea. Perhaps you weren't looking for advice. You've probably tried a lot. I don't want to downplay your struggle. I am really sorry that doctors aren't believing you and what you need. I think that's something a lot of people here can relate to. I wish there were more I could do. Be careful out there. 

 

deathrabbit- I don't think there's much wrong with how I choose how to raise him either. I just wish everyone, including my husband, would understand that. I guess that's the hardest thing about raising children; mothers and fathers usually have far different ideas as to the ideal way to teach their children. I have done a huge amount of research. That what I did most of my pregnancy. I read, read, read. And the research I read, the way I chose to look at things, made sense to me. Unfortunately, research doesn't matter to a lot of people. Statistics are looked at as totally fabricated to some. And there is no compromising with people like that. So I either get to do things my way and have any issue my son has (even normal toddler issues) blamed on me. Or I let my husband do what he thinks is best, even though I think it could create undesired repercussions,  so sayeth studies that have been done. Such is life.

I do totally understand what you mean about what's expected of men. I commend you for being honest and blunt about how it makes you feel. Many people can't do that. However, if that's who you are, there is no sense in fighting it. If that's what the medicine you need has made you into, accept it and try not to be so harsh on yourself. My father-in-law is said to be the very same way (I have yet to see it). I have never once heard anyone ridicule him because of it. Even when my family complains about him, like if my mother-and-law and I are in a man-bashing vent fest, that never is something brought up. Honestly. But she evens him out so it's never really been an issue. I think, for men, you upset yourself over things like that (being emotional, crying) because it's not what's expected of you. But here's a secret. No one, no actual human, expects you to be an unemotional, uncrying, unwavering rock. I think a lot of women like to see emotion. Sure, some can't handle it, but those are people that don't have a grasp of their own emotions and it merely leaks out into how they perceive others. I think we'd all be surprised at the amount of men and women that are totally accepting of emotion. Sounds like you just need to reevaluate the things you're telling to yourself when you get emotional. We are our own worst enemies and we are our own worst critics. But that also means that we can be our own savior. 



#6 DeathRabbit

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 10:32 AM

Maybe I do need to curtai lthe negative self-talk, but I genuinely still believe, deep down I think, that I shouldn't be crying. Having feelings and emotions is okay. But once I cry, I'm just a *BEEP*ing wimp and I should go ahead and turn in my penis. And I have to try hard to not let the self-hate to just turn into general hate. I used to be a much more mellow person, and even though I'm still pretty good about not picking fights with people, I'm no longer able to rise above and diffuse the situation or just simply walk away and leave them to be the one stewing. There's a great song where the singer was talking about his depression driven anger so he was like "Truth be told, I really hate myself, so *BEEP* YOU!!!" And that's really how it goes sometimes in my mind. I get so angry at people, and it's often for no reason, so I just bottle it, which I'm luckily very good at. Years of dealing with bad anxiety have given me the game face of a pro. It's amazing how most people somehow believe I'm a confident, well-adjusted and helathy individual. I went to a therapist once and after three appointments, she tried to send me away because she aid she couldn't tel lthere was anythign worng with me beyond normal stress. So I was like, "Oh really? Does a normal person punch the door jam til his knuckles bleed to punish himself for everyday failures? Does he go to bed at night fervently praying he won't wake up in the morning?" She was floored.



#7 iturnedintoamartian

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 10:58 AM

It's kind of funny in an ironic sense that I am very similar. I have done pretty much the exact same as you- punching a door just to create pain. I used to be a cutter because it took the emotional pain and transferred it into physical. It actually worked. That was when I was younger, though. I think, in many ways, that I just became very numb to a lot of things. I went through a lot in high school, more emotional trauma than anyone should have to go through, and I really think it numbed me. At the 3rd funeral, I didn't cry. I only had small waves of even feeling like I wanted to. I still get emotional, of course, and I still care about things, but, in person, it's very, very, very hard for me to show it. I don't even think I know how. When I try, I get all awkward and regret trying.

I think that everyone kind of has the same things go through their head whilst crying. So, in that, calling yourself a wuss, etc., you're not alone at all. As long as that's the only time you're putting yourself down like that. And I do hope that you don't actually hope to not wake up in the morning. If so, you definitely have some work to do on how you see yourself. Hating yourself destroys you and those around you. Trust me. My husband is like that. It's awful. It's totally awful. It has severely compromised our marriage and his interaction with his son. It has interrupted his work and made him very irresponsible for a very long time. It's made him downright mean. Do you know how hard it is to be a spose, have an awesome child with that spouse, and hear them say that they absolutely hate their life and you know, truly know, that they'll probably never be happy no matter what you do, and not know how to help? Please try to work on it. For the sake of your future wife and family, for you, if you truly feel that way, I beg of you, work on it. Disliking yourself, knowing you need to be a better person and that you are currently not nearly as great as you need to be- that's all normal. You keep trying to better yourself and become a better person. But really, truly hating yourself, there's something much deeper in that. It's something no one else can fix for you and it's probably something that medicine would only bury but not solve. I fully believe that it doesn't have to be that way, though. 

Boy, that ended on a depressing not, eh? Yikes. 



#8 sk8aplexy

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 01:47 PM

I've not read all of this.

I find rebound depression or just fatigue and being down, to be common.  It's one or the other, pretty commonly, always it seems.

But, the things that help me out are this:

-Remembering that really I can only look out for myself and there will always be unknowns as well as natural occurences; there's only so much that one can control, in life.

-Reflecting and recognizing, being aware and conscious, are crucial to any contentness and actual balance.

-So much comes down to two words:  balance and proportion.

-Taking time each day to stretch my limbs/breathing slowly/counting in my head slowly as I stretch/focusing inwards on my bodies circulation and rhythm/forgetting whatever else is or has been going on, while I do this exercise; it's a sort of meditation state that I find really helps me in many, variable, ways.

-When I am really down, I eat, which requires me to cook something (most of the time) and cooking for me is a other form, or routine, that I find to be very calming and soothing as it takes my mind off of whatever and requires focus with attention upon what I'm doing, and then eating the yum is pleasant.

-Minimize stresses and anxieties, not rushing and running races (as much as possible - I know we all have to have money but think about the fact you're in a first world country, it's not always so bad, nor necessary [in certain respects]); calm and tranquility is essential for any and every -one-...

-Another beneficial thing, is taking a walk or perhaps going out to the woods, or a lake.  Getting out of the place I am most always in, can be hugely beneficial.

-Understanding from others, is not a very 'actual' or 'existing' thing, to be found.  Often people are willing to speak words that mean absolutely nothing, to please and/or accomodate the other, in the moment.  Not so often do you (or maybe I should be speaking only for myself here) find real understanding aside from some sliver of the situation/occurence/topic and -one- must be able to interally grasp and/or compensate accordingly what it is that they are having, or have, difficulty/ies with, by themselves... 

-It can be tough, but remember life is fascinating and there are ups and downs, for all; depression is only a word or perhaps propaganda ([!]-I don't know- ).



#9 doinmdirndest

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 06:08 AM

this reply is from a brand new username, see the 'i' in place of the 'a'? after my spending 7 hours entering an old article 'on the treatment of narcolepsy' by hand. it is an old article and obtaining a hard copy was not easy. this effort gave pwn here the first and only online access to the full-text version of the article.

not knowing if the nn compose page times out, and since no 'save as a draft' feature/icon appears on it i hunt-and-pecked it in w/o taking breaks, save a minute or two to use the bathroom/grab refreshments. i felt i did a good thing for the extremely few other pwn out there who benefit from massive doses of meds like Adderall, or who would. i am certain they exist as i'm not from another planet. it did my heart good to see it there where anybody could print it for free.

the next thing i know try to log in to nn and find out i got permanently suspended by Karen rorie of the nn moderating team. w/o explanation, the article had vanished from where i put it in the form of a post in 'treatment'. i knew this because i looked at the forum before logging in. afterward i could not log out and if i tried to read the forum the 'sorry, you don't have permission for that' page was all i could get, but i figured out that deleting cookies, active x something-or-other and a couple of other things let me back in to look at the nn forums and to set up this new username, but some comveniences like drop down menus and remembered passwords were/are gone.

the article is from dr Robert yoss, a pioneer in n. tx. it tends to corroborate my oft repeated assertion here that for some of us, high dose traditional stimulants are the best tx option for the treatment of eds. a bogus explanation was given me as to why i was banned by Karen rorie involving another post 'poor mali einen of Stanford sleep' which was in 'free writing' for 2 months. why didn't it get removed sooner?

it is/was mostly a courteous apology, but k.r. claimed it was 'hateful,insulting' and said i was permanently suspended and since its gone from her removing it, no evidence exists to prove that she is lying. and as if telling the truth informs me im banned from seeing or contributing to the forum.

no mention of the article by dr yoss was made; it was online from my hard work less than a weeek

deathrabbit-in no way am i discounting your well learned medical understanding of how/why 'stimmies' are of dubious value in n. sx tx.

seems plain to see you have a lot more on the ball than the way you tell of how you see yourself reflects. if your essays here in nn on the matter were handed to me and somebody said it was an article from a dr or phd laureate they would only be credible, and you get props from me.

but there is a 2 word reason as to why it can't apply to my wakefulness promoting rx (270 mg/d Adderall) . it works. that is all i know.

this reply is an afterthought, the purpose of the new username is to take it to the other moderators. i got this done, i think that my new username might get shut down as well in a very short time. it is very depressing; i was at a big enough disadvantage in my attempts to assert my beleifs here regarding eds tx, and i was already depressed enough the hard times really f. w/me; i am a workaholic type and i used to get o.t. most weeks w/ 2 or more project supers debating which jobsite this laborer would be coming to work o the next day was so par for the course. now i'm lucky to work a couple of days.

i didn't need your help, k.r., if you ever look here. you have no posts in nn. maybe you do not have our disease.
i awlways figured my posts would be there for the next person w/my indications to read. now the most useful one is gone, the profile page for 'doinmdarndest' icon 'find content' is gone too. so are all my nn conversations. over 2 years worth.

this really sucks. there is nothing right about it, and there's nothing i can do about it. my best option is to forget nn, don't know why i persist. asserting the truth cannot have such importance when it's futile, time and again.

i am guilty of neglecting my fine, fragile, warm hearted chick i live w/that loves me w/my nose to the pc monitor here in a different room f.ing w/this s. for hours at a time for absolutely nothing.

peace/one love/out.

#10 ironhands

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 12:07 PM

Based on family history, depression has always been my sole diagnosis.  I was so looking forward to my problems being sleep apnea, because there's a solution.

 

Great to have a label, but means I'm not going to be "cured".

 

It's always killed any relationships, which only leads to more depression and self worth issues.  Lack of energy makes it hard to find a good job.  Plus the slight obesity which will hopefully change.

 

Just feels like I'll be stuck in the same rut for the rest of my life, no family support, and friends have all moved on.



#11 Livi

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 01:20 PM

Hey Iron,

You probably do have sleep apnea which you know can be treated, and you still have to schedule the MSLT, right?   I know you want to have narcolepsy because it would be a relief to you to have a diagnosis, but whether it's narcolepsy or IH doesn't really matter.  You can get treatment with stimulants and your life can improve.  I want you to feel better and I know that you can make it through this.  Lack of energy might make it hard to find a good job, but once you find one, they can't let you go because of your disability.  I don't know how it works in Canada, but here you still need a job for health insurance, so a job is really important.  I am sitting here at my job right now not being able to focus on my work, but somehow I pull through, and so can you.  I hope your diagnosis and doctors will help you out the way you need. Maybe you can keep going to the doctor(s) at the sleep center instead of finding idiot doctors who know nothing about sleep disorders.

You won't be stuck in the same rut for the rest of your life.  There's hope for feeling better.  You're doing a really good job with being self-disciplined enough to take care of yourself and manage your sleepiness.  I wish I was that self-disciplined.  It would help to have a partner to encourage each other.  (A cat can't really help with that -  referencing another post).  And I'll be your friend if you want.  :)

Livi



#12 ironhands

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 01:41 PM

my PSG showed zero apnea events

 

Companies can boot you no matter what disability you have, they just have to make something up.  Constructive dismissal isn't difficult to pull off.  I have a stable job but it's nothing special to brag about, it's 9-5 and covers my rent.  Just the SSDD that most go through, but for me it's coupled with N.



#13 Livi

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 01:47 PM

Iron -

Yeah.... well..... after seeing your hypnogram, I'd question that PSG analysis.....   anyway, you'll have another one if you're doing an MSLT soon.

A stable job that covers your rent is WAY better than nothing!  

 

I don't get to see my doctor at the sleep center until Sept. 6th and I am too tired to do anything.  My strong emotions at my diagnosis made my EDS that much worse.  So I found some old methylin tablets from 2010.  They've been expired for 2 years but I just took a couple, and i'm jittery but no effect on the extreme EDS.

I'll have to check the Meds forum to see what's up with that?!   

 

I'm glad I found this support group because I feel the same way  -  SSDD, but coupled with N.   (and BPD, another disability).  Life is not easy, that's for sure.  I was pretty much at rock bottom last week, but watch the movie "Life of Pi."  It might have something in it for you.  



#14 ironhands

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 02:48 PM

Hypnogram checks out, I remember most of the times it shows me being awakened, though I can't confirm the REM states, obviously.  The remaining charts look normal.  O2 didn't drop below 91 at the lowest.  no PLMs.

 

I was furious during my sleep study; it was great.  I almost punched someone.



#15 Livi

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 03:56 PM

PLMs don't mean anything for sleep apnea. What was your RDI?

I almost punched somebody too the first time I did the MSLT. - the tech who woke me up from my REM nap by coming in and turning on the lights. He obviously had no people skills whatsoever.

#16 ironhands

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 04:48 PM

No, but it could be another factor in why I'm so tired.

RDI was 0.00