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Ral L-Carnitine


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#1 NetiNeti

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 01:24 PM

Has anyone tried Oral L-Carnitine? Its a relatively new study. 

 

"To assess the efficacy of oral L-carnitine for the treatment of narcolepsy, we performed a clinical trial administering L-carnitine (510 mg/day) to patients with the disease. The study design was a randomized, double-blind, cross-over and placebo-controlled trial. Thirty narcolepsy patients were enrolled in our study. Two patients were withdrawn and 28 patients were included in the statistical analysis (15 males and 13 females, all with HLA-DQB1*06:02). L-carnitine treatment significantly improved the total time for dozing off during the daytime, calculated from the sleep logs, compared with that of placebo-treated periods. L-carnitine efficiently increased serum acylcarnitine levels, and reduced serum triglycerides concentration." 

 

http://www.plosone.o...al.pone.0053707

 

Also 


"This study suggests that oral L-carnitine can be effective in reducing excessive daytime sleepiness in narcolepsy patients."

 - http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/23349733



#2 DeathRabbit

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 12:52 AM

That's in a lot of energy drinks actually. They they have got lots of crap thats bad from you, chiefly, a crap ton of taurine and caffeine.



#3 NetiNeti

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 07:56 AM

I am going to start it today for 60 days and see if anything is different. 



#4 DeathRabbit

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:13 AM

Good, good. Keep us posted so you can be our guinea pig :P . But seriously, lets us know how it works out.



#5 NetiNeti

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 03:13 PM

I picked up the 500 mg tablets from GNC. They cost like $25 for a 2 month supply. Unlike in the study, you have to take it all at once in one pill and not three times a day in smaller doses.

I'll keep you guys posted. Maybe one week updates? Or every few days. If anyone else wants to join.... feel free :lol: .

Edit: Here is the study that lead to the new study. It is by the same author: http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3041711/

 

The LAST sentence is key.

"Narcolepsy patients are at a higher risk of non–insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus16 and obesity,1619 suggesting the abnormality in energy homeostasis. The dysfunction in hypocretin/orexin neurotransmission observed as the major pathophysiology of narcolepsy20,21 is suggested to be related to obesity.22 However, animal studies have indicated that several factors other than hypocretin also contribute to obesity in patients with narcolepsy.23,24 Furthermore, mice with systemic carnitine deficiency showed decreased hypocretin neuron activity and fragmented sleep.25"



#6 DeathRabbit

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:40 PM

I'm on so many meds right now, throwing another one into the mix might be a bad idea, haha. But if you get results, I'll talk to my sleep guy about it.



#7 NetiNeti

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 10:11 PM

Alright, my one week update. In short, it has worked better then expected. 

Some background; I have mild narcolepsy w/o cataplexy. I suffer from EDS, sleep attacks, irregular REM cycles, etc. I generally have 2-3 sleep attacks a day and they are usually consistent from day to day. The EDS has been the thing that has gotten progressively worst over the years. I limit my carb intake and I am a  vegetarian partly because I don't feel as "weighed down" or tired. Carbs usually trigger a spike then a sleep attack....so I either eat whole grains (still not that  to  many) or none at all. I consistently get 7 to 9 hours of sleep a night. I am on Nuvigil (150mg), but I take two "holidays" during the week. One on Wednesday and one on Sunday. 

I started the L-Carnitine (500mg) after reading the above studies and some studies on individuals suffering from Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS). The idea is that CFS and Narcolepsy may have some similar biological underpinnings which contribute to EDS. This involves long-chain fatty acid breakdown for energy, which contribute to metabolism. L-Carnitine supplementation is supposed to help with the long-chain fatty acid breakdown that we are perhaps just bad at, and either do not produce enough L-Carnitine or use it effectivly. As a vegetarian, my L-Carnitine levels are already lower, so take that into account.This is the only thing I have changed in my diet / routine. I do workout 4-6 times a week as it helps keep me going. 

The L-Carnitine has helped with the EDS more then I expected. Even on my off days for the Nuvigil (like today) I do not feel as tired as I would normally. Oddly, my evening sleep attack period has almost disappeared. Even when on the Nuvigil (or ritalin before that) I could FEEL my brain wanting to shut down, but the drug kept me awake. So far on the L-Carnitine, I have not experienced that....for the afternoon anyway. The morning one is still there. It is still hard waking up in the morning (takes me at least an hour). But the L-Carnitine is giving me something....maybe a stable energy/metabolism release over the day? I do not know. I don't feel the crashes as much, if at all. I am also a lot warmer then usual, or at least I feel that way. I actually could not fall asleep one night this week like I usually can...it took me a while. 

This is just week one though. I will keep updating as the weeks go on. I do take the L-Carnitine daily, along with a multi-vitamin and fish oil (I know, but the stuff is just so good for you). But I have to say, for just one week it has worked wonders --- I am going to stick with it. 
 



#8 DeathRabbit

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Posted 13 May 2013 - 11:10 PM

Sounds promising, man! Keep us updated. I might consider giving it a shot pretty soon since your having such success.



#9 NetiNeti

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 08:59 PM

Week two, still going strong. I still feel hotter then usual, but it might just be the seasons changing. :-p. Nothing too significant though. It is still working pretty well. 



#10 DeathRabbit

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Posted 21 May 2013 - 09:43 AM

Well I think I may grab some at Walgreens today when I go for my 5-htp.



#11 NetiNeti

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 08:50 PM

How has it been working for you DeathRabbit?

Alright, it's been about a month now. Still going good! It really helps with the EDS. I still get the sleep attacks (especially if I am not on my Nuvigil), but I do not feel as lethargic during the day. Its a much different "clear" then the ones provided by the pharmaceuticals. 

I am still warmer then usual. I thought it was just the weather changing, but it's been a month now. Perhaps it is effecting my metabolism in some way that I am unaware of. That is what it is supposed to do though, heh.  



#12 DeathRabbit

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Posted 04 June 2013 - 10:11 AM

Actually, I haven't seen much benefit, unfortunately. Did you get the horse pills or the liquid? I got the pills nmyself, so I wonder if I'm not getting a lot of absorption. It does help me workout, though if I take it 30 mintues before workout on an empty stomach.



#13 NetiNeti

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Posted 04 June 2013 - 03:19 PM

I take the GNC pill in the morning on an empty stomach.



#14 DeathRabbit

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Posted 04 June 2013 - 04:28 PM

Lol I'm taking like 3 a day, haha.

#15 NetiNeti

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Posted 05 June 2013 - 06:12 PM

That's a lot! 



#16 DeathRabbit

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 02:34 PM

Well according to my bottle, it's actually an underdose for the pills I got. They recommend 4 a day.



#17 GuruMeditationError

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 06:11 PM

 I take Nuvigil which would be enough to keep me awake, but at times I just wouldn't have the energy to do anything. On several occassions I wanted to play video games, but lacked the necessary mental focus and concentration to do so, even though I was still awake due to the Nuvigil.  That was the first time that I ever thought of my Narcolepsy as having a negative impact on my life. At those times I would take a 5 hour energy or RedBull to wake me up enough to do what I wanted to do.Still I would have to wait 20 minutes for the caffeine to kick in even then the caffeine wasn't always reliable solution to this problem.

 

I started taking L-Carnitine in combo with COq10 and Omega-3 when I heard it on some health talk show as a energy booster, sometime late last year.  I saw immedate results. The combo of the three has improved my wakefulness greatly.

I still need Nuvigil, and I still get sleep attacks, especially after a meal but I no longer experience that state of being just barely awake.

 

I have taken both the liquid and pill form of L-Carnitine.  LIquid seems to work faster than the pill.  Weather or not the Coq10 and Omega-3 make a difference, I don't know.

Coq10 is an expensive supplement.  I'll probably take it until I run out then see if there is a difference without it.

 

I was searching to see if there was any corelation between Narcolepsy and elevated triglyceride levels, when I found this L-Carnitine study. 

On my last health check, my cholesterol levels were borderline, but my triglycerides were high (298).

My next health check is coming up soon, hopefully I'll see a drop in my triglyceride levels.

 

As for dosage, there were some other studies done on the L-Carnitine's affect on cholesterol. In those studies participants took up to 2 grams a day, with no bad effects. So it looks like there is room for finding what dosage best works for you.



#18 NetiNeti

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Posted 19 June 2013 - 12:53 PM

That's excellent that you have seen results as well. That state of being barely wake (or just barely wake) has also disappeared with me as well. My sleep attacks are now less severe (but still there, especially after eating like you mentioned), even on my "drug holiday" days.  I find myself sitting around sometimes "bored" and not falling asleep. It has defiantly been a change from the last 6-7 years of my life.

How much do you take daily? That new meta-study has some flaws in it. Follow-up research is defiantly needed.

 

I also take Omega-3s (DHA, 1,200 mg daily). I am not sure if it has any effects with Narcolepsy, I started taking it for other health benefits.

 



#19 DeathRabbit

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Posted 19 June 2013 - 01:11 PM

I got the concentrated liquid from body fortress. I've been taking it every time before I exercise and that stuff has been a whole lot more effective than pills of L-Carnitine for me. Although, one must adhere to their advice of taking it with food, because the one time I didn't eat before I took it, I felt like I had an orb of power in my stomach which was very painful and also I felt like I had injected myself with cocaine and meth at the same time for about 15 minutes, then I crashed unbelivably hard.



#20 NetiNeti

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 04:29 PM

That sucks. Perhaps liquid uptake is too quick? How much do you take? 

The liquid form is more expensive...eh