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Rem Behaviour Disorder As Early N Symptom?


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Poll: Childhood Parasomnias? (14 member(s) have cast votes)

As a child did you experience parasomnias(s)

  1. Yes, sleepwalking (7 votes [19.44%])

    Percentage of vote: 19.44%

  2. Yes, sleeptalking (11 votes [30.56%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.56%

  3. Yes, night terrors (7 votes [19.44%])

    Percentage of vote: 19.44%

  4. Yes, REM behaviours (6 votes [16.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.67%

  5. Not sure (4 votes [11.11%])

    Percentage of vote: 11.11%

  6. No (1 votes [2.78%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.78%

Do you now experince parasomnia(s)?

  1. Yes, sleepwalking (4 votes [12.50%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.50%

  2. Yes, sleeptalking (10 votes [31.25%])

    Percentage of vote: 31.25%

  3. Yes, night terrors (6 votes [18.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.75%

  4. Yes, REM behaviours (9 votes [28.12%])

    Percentage of vote: 28.12%

  5. Not sure (2 votes [6.25%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.25%

  6. No (1 votes [3.12%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.12%

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#1 eww

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Posted 13 June 2009 - 08:41 PM

I just finished a big midterm so I figured I'd indulge myself with some *light* Narcolepsy research article reading. Clearly I'm a nerd but whatever. I came across a rather interesting article from 2007. It's a limited scope case study of two girls (7 and 9), and it's specifically about REM Behaviour Disorder and childhood Narcolepsy. But I did find it intriguing that it puts forward the idea that these things could be one of the first symptoms of Narcolepsy. Apparently parasomnias (both REM and NREM) are far more common among the adult N populations but I haven't found much other than this article about childhood experiences.

I know as a kid I sleepwalked and sleeptalked. My mother and I used to have grand old chats in the middle of the night that I never had any recollection of afterwards. I'm not sure about acting out my dreams as a small child, but I know I do now on occasion. I talk through my dreams too.

I was wondering what all you lovelies had to say about this. Any ideas? Connections you can make? Experiences you'd like to share?

Have I forgotten any pertinent parasomnias?

#2 Lais02

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Posted 13 June 2009 - 11:38 PM

Can you clarify what REM behaviors and night terrors are. I guess I could go look them up, but I'm heading to bed instead sorry... one of those must go to bed now feelings.

Interesting poll though... great idea!

#3 with waking nightmares...

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Posted 14 June 2009 - 12:24 AM

That is an interesting question.
I never really had any parasomnias or REM behaviour, but sometimes someone will come into my room and try and wake me up, and I never fully wake up....sometimes I'll have a conversation with them, which I'll have no recollection of, and then go back to sleep. They'll think I was awake, but there's no way I was really awake. That's not exactly "sleep talking" though. It used to happen much more often a few years ago than it does now.



#4 jenji

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Posted 14 June 2009 - 01:03 AM

Great topic, Eww.

I did sleepwalk as a kid, in fact I can remember my parents bringing up a particular incident where I had apparently walked into the living room while they were watching television and asked: "did you get the boat ready?"

Any my parents could tell I was sleepwalking and so they said: "yes, it is, now go back to bed."

And I said: "okay, but are you sure it's ready b/c it needs to be ready."

And they said: "jenji, it's ready we promise, now go back to bed, everything is okay."

And with that mom said she walked me back to bed and I got in and went back to "sleep."

Here's the best part: Um, yeah....sooooo we didn't have a boat. lol

Anyway, I had quite a few sleepwalking issues as a youngster and the occasional SP/HH, one in particular I can remember from inside my crib, so clearly I was just a toddler at that point, however for the most part my major problem was with night terrors that I can recall. They were horrific and I wouldn't wish them on any child, let alone adult. But oddly enough, the night terrors were eventually pretty much replaced with mainly SP/HH as I got older, quite regularly from 11 years or so on and since then they have continued.

And isn't it unreal that I didn't learn until last year that my SP/HH were in fact a sx of N. All those years I spent thinking I was insane; all those years where I didn't breathe a word about the "people in my room" at night. All those years that the shrinks I confided in told me that those "people in my room" were my stepfather abusing me. And it wasn't. It was them; the trio; the trio I highlighted in one of my films that many of you have so kindly viewed.

And finally, there are many individuals who would insist that I would strike out whilst sleeping: kicking, punching at those who slept beside me. The cat finally wised up and doesn't sleep with me anymore; my significant others throughout the years weathered it quite well considering some had received a charlie horse or two. I think this was REM Behavior Disorder, but that got much better once I got into my 30's.

Odd how things progress or regress isn't it? Interesting stuff.

best,
jenji

#5 Mr BluBerry

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Posted 14 June 2009 - 05:41 AM

QUOTE (jenji @ Jun 14 2009, 07:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And it wasn't. It was them; the trio; the trio I highlighted in one of my films that many of you have so kindly viewed.


'Seeing the enemy: dead skin and blackened eyes,
a pack of guys from the afterlife coming back in time'

QUOTE (jenji @ Jun 14 2009, 07:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And finally, there are many individuals who would insist that I would strike out whilst sleeping: kicking, punching at those who slept beside me.


thats why no one would ever share a bed with me when i was younger lol.

ive always been a restless sleeper and i never stay still at night. i alwyas wake up in a completely differnt position 2 when i go to bed and people alwyas comment on the fact that i dont ever stay still

#6 malachi777

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Posted 14 June 2009 - 06:56 PM

I have never had issues with sleep walking, although I do move a lot while asleep. It is completely normal to move while asleep. It is a way for the body get comfortable, prevent soft tissue damage and unintentionally whack your mate on the other side of the bed...

#7 eww

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Posted 14 June 2009 - 10:04 PM

What I mean by "REM Behaviours" is things like acting out your dreams, speaking while dreaming those sorts of things. Sleepwalking and sleep talking are fairly normal, but apparently they mostly happen during other sleep stages. REM Behaviour Disorder (RBD) is REM dysfunction that happens when your body fails to go into (or completely into) REM atonia. It's kind of the reverse of cataplexy. In cataplexy your brain thinks you're asleep so shuts down voluntary muscle movement whereas with RBD your brain kinda thinks it's awake so it doesn't shut down muscle movement. Make sense?

A night terror is when you don't completely wake up from NREM sleep in a confused and terrified state. It's nearly impossible to wake someone from a night terror. They usually go back to sleep themselves. Night terrors usually cause things like screaming, moaning or other scared noises. They can be quite frightening for others but the person rarely remembers.

I had a friend in middle school who had night terrors. On a school trip four of us were in a hotel room and in the middle of the night J calmly got up, walked to the middle of the room and screamed bloody murder. Scared the flippin' daylights out of us. When she was done she calmly went back to bed like nothing had ever happened. Was asleep the whole time. The three of us girls in the room had been warned beforehand but the teachers were really hard to pacify. J was dead to the world asleep by the time they got to our room.

And yes moving in your sleep is perfectly normal. Kicking your significant other in the groin because you're being held captive in the congo and you're not fond of your prison guard counts as abnormal "REM behaviour". My (former) s/o got over it eventually. laugh.gif

#8 Irishhh

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 11:07 AM

I totally had night terrors. I don't remember anything about them. I just know that I'd wake up screaming and crying, staring off in a trance. I don't remember this part, but my family describes it as I didn't recognize any of them. I didn't try to get away, but I'd just stare and scream cry etc.

I don't know when it stopped, I think around when I was five.

I eventually started having sleep paralysis and hallucinations. I've had two out of body experiences, and one of which was extremely painful. I don't know if they are really out of body exps or if it has to do with narcolepsy. One was when I was about 12, the other I was 19. I'm 23 now.

I have very vidid dreams now, some of which can be terrifying and hallucinogenic. I often have dreams so real that I think they really happen. I find myself asking people often if something really happened or not. Things just pop into my head like memories quite often. Things that seem like, yeah that was real. I've even asked friends, you remember when blah blah... they'll be like uh no. and i'll realize it was one of my dreams!

Whatever those night terrors were when I was a kid I dont know. I can't compare them to what I go through now because I don't remember them. Also as a child I did wake up from nightmares which I did remember, I still remember quite a few of them now. That was different than the night terrors.

#9 Irishhh

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 11:16 AM

Oh, I forgot. I've always talked in my sleep. Some people have been known to have conversations with me lol

Once the phone rang and I held my hand up to my ear saying hello over and over even while the phone kept ringing. I was under 10 when that happened.

and when I was about 15 my mom brough the phone to me while I was napping. Apparently I acknowledged her and took the phone. I woke up to the sound of a dial tone.

Plenty of times people have come in to talk to me and I've responded. Plenty of other times people have come in to talk to me and I couldn't respond, but could hear them and tried to talk. I've even thought I was thrashing my arms or legs in attempt to get them to realize I was talking. I actually think I'm moving sometimes, but people will tell me I wasn't.

This whole narcolepsy thing is so weird!

#10 polkadotvans

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Posted 05 July 2009 - 10:15 PM

When I was diagnosed, I looked back on my life and it is obvious to me that I've had N since childhood (even tho they say it appears in adolescence). I had sleepwalking, talking and horrific nightmares constantly, plus the excessive sleepiness all the time.

What I want to know now is the chances of my 2 kids having it. Normally, I'd think the chances would be quite slim, just barely above the national average. However, my daughter has had many very odd sleep moments that everyone who knows her well has commented on all by themselves (prior to my diagnosis). And my 4-year-old son has night terrors (textbook ones too, so I'm sure that's what they are). Luckily they're only about once every 6 months, and he doesn't show any other odd sleep symptoms.

So now I'm more concerned than I would've been otherwise.... The good news is that if they do indeed have N, at least they'll have knowledgeable and caring parents to identify it early on and BELIEVE THEM and understand them, etc.! They won't hear from their mom, "Are you on drugs?"